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Post by philip42h on Oct 26, 2024 17:41:53 GMT
Looks stunning 👍👍👍 I saw one of these in Ludlow today. It was exiting a side road I was crossing ( on foot ) and it went up the hill at some rate of knots. At first I thought it was a VW ID4 like my daughter has but I then saw the badges on the back. The ID and the BZ are big cars with a similar profile I knew the Volkswagen was but didn’t know the BZ4 was…. The car certainly shot up the hill and away very smartly indeed. I kept my eyes open when walking round Ludlow in case I saw it and could have a closer look but no joy….. It's certainly not a small car, but not much bigger than the RAV4 and feels very similar in size to drive. In comparison with the RAV4.5, the bZ4X is 5mm wider, 40mm lower, and 90mm longer - and 345 kg heavier! And the wheelbase is 160 mm longer which means that there's masses of legroom in the back (particularly when I am, or my even shorter wife is, driving). Just like the RAV4, it still fits in the garage, into standard size parking spaces and doesn't feel any larger when manoeuvering about town etc. But whereas the RAV4 (on 18" wheels shod with Michelin Cross Climates) after 4 years feels quite agile and 'chuckable', the bZ4X feels a tad more 'ponderous'. The AWD version of the 4.5 hybrid knocks of 0-62 in 8.1 seconds; the AWD version of the bZ4X cuts that down to 6.9 seconds and does so without shouting about it (the RAV4 hybrid let's you know all about it when you ask it to shift!). But it's not particularly 'quick' compared with the EV competition - the twin motor version of the EX30 would cut that down to 3.6 seconds but that's just silly. I bought the car for comfort rather than outright speed and it's certainly quick enough ... |
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Post by charliefarlie on Oct 26, 2024 17:55:39 GMT
Looks stunning 👍👍👍 I saw one of these in Ludlow today. It was exiting a side road I was crossing ( on foot ) and it went up the hill at some rate of knots. At first I thought it was a VW ID4 like my daughter has but I then saw the badges on the back. The ID and the BZ are big cars with a similar profile I knew the Volkswagen was but didn’t know the BZ4 was…. The car certainly shot up the hill and away very smartly indeed. I kept my eyes open when walking round Ludlow in case I saw it and could have a closer look but no joy….. It's certainly not a small car, but not much bigger than the RAV4 and feels very similar in size to drive. In comparison with the RAV4.5, the bZ4X is 5mm wider, 40mm lower, and 90mm longer - and 345 kg heavier! And the wheelbase is 160 mm longer which means that there's masses of legroom in the back (particularly when I am, or my even shorter wife is, driving). Just like the RAV4, it still fits in the garage, into standard size parking spaces and doesn't feel any larger when manoeuvering about town etc. But whereas the RAV4 (on 18" wheels shod with Michelin Cross Climates) after 4 years feels quite agile and 'chuckable', the bZ4X feels a tad more 'ponderous'. The AWD version of the 4.5 hybrid knocks of 0-62 in 8.1 seconds; the AWD version of the bZ4X cuts that down to 6.9 seconds and does so without shouting about it (the RAV4 hybrid let's you know all about it when you ask it to shift!). But it's not particularly 'quick' compared with the EV competition - the twin motor version of the EX30 would cut that down to 3.6 seconds but that's just silly. I bought the car for comfort rather than outright speed and it's certainly quick enough ... Something my son likes about his electric car is most electric parking spaces are much much bigger and wider than the normal ones. Big as or bigger than disabled bays, He shares my hatred of door dingers that uae most car parks so if he’s going into Worcester for example he will park in an electric bag and hook up his cable. He would rather buy a bit of electric than have his car dinged, The daughter doesn't care it’s a company car so nothing more than a tool , The BZ is a cracking sized car. Again I draw a loose parallel to the VW in that both are really much bigger than first impressions give. 👍👍 |
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Post by charliefarlie on Oct 29, 2024 17:11:42 GMT
Saw a BZ4X on a retail park in Worcester this afternoon. Same colour as Phillips but the wing badge said BEV instead if Electric ? I’m supposing it means Battery Electric Vehicle ? I tried to have a look through the window at the interior but on top of what looked like a high centre console was a very unhappy and angry dog that went absolutely berserk. I hope that centre console was sturdy and not piano black.
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Post by philip42h on Oct 29, 2024 17:31:02 GMT
Saw a BZ4X on a retail park in Worcester this afternoon. Same colour as Phillips but the wing badge said BEV instead if Electric ? I’m supposing it means Battery Electric Vehicle ? I tried to have a look through the window at the interior but on top of what looked like a high centre console was a very unhappy and angry dog that went absolutely berserk. I hope that centre console was sturdy and not piano black. Ah, yes - I've got a brand new, obsolete one! Mine was built in October 2023.  For the 2024 model, they changed the badging from Electric to BEV - I guess it made the badge a little cheaper? And, yes, that high and wide centre console is, you guessed it, nice and shiny piano black so (a) it will be a pain to keep looking good, and (b) it will create irritating reflections if ever the sun comes out! I'll post a picture from the driver's seat and comment on what's good and what's quirky ... |
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Post by charliefarlie on Oct 29, 2024 17:46:16 GMT
Saw a BZ4X on a retail park in Worcester this afternoon. Same colour as Phillips but the wing badge said BEV instead if Electric ? I’m supposing it means Battery Electric Vehicle ? I tried to have a look through the window at the interior but on top of what looked like a high centre console was a very unhappy and angry dog that went absolutely berserk. I hope that centre console was sturdy and not piano black. Ah, yes - I've got a brand new, obsolete one! Mine was built in October 2023. For the 2024 model, they changed the badging from Electric to BEV - I guess it made the badge a little cheaper? And, yes, that high and wide centre console is, you guessed it, nice and shiny piano black so (a) it will be a pain to keep looking good, and (b) it will create irritating reflections if ever the sun comes out! I'll post a picture from the driver's seat and comment on what's good and what's quirky ... From what I could see the interior looke ultra modern with the large screen most cars seem to have now, I was next to the passenger side so didn’t get a look at what the driver sees. The hound was going truly mental so I resisted having a proper look. Again I got the impression of how big the cars are. I’d say bigger than the RAV4 and appears a lot bigger than your numbers suggest. I do like a big car.. My daughter was due to have a BZ but the delays at the time meant she had to choose something that was available so she ended up with the ID4 by default really. Her cars roll over every two years 3 if they choose to take that option. At the end of the term she is usually ( not always ) offered the option to buy the car… I think the BZ would be a much better prospect to buy but not the VW it’s never lived up to its promise. It’s big comfortable reasonably quick but not fast like some but it’s had lots and lots of issues. It’s range being the main one. I expect the BZ will be much better. |
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Post by philip42h on Oct 29, 2024 19:52:50 GMT
In a game of top trumps, the ID.4 wins hands down ... but it's not a Toyota, and the bZ4X is. I haven't driven an ID.4 but I understand that they rather gone over the top with haptic buttons and touch controls; the bZ4X has proper buttons and knobs where it should and drives like a car. Anyhow, Charlie said the R word and that really determines whether or not we can each live with an EV. So ... My RAV 4.5 hybrid had a range of about 500 miles and the tank could be refilled pretty much anywhere in ten minutes so the effective limitation on how far you can go in a day is the driver (or drivers). And it would do around 10 miles to the litre, summer or winter so if you filled the tank at a local supermarket it costs around 13p per mile or around 16p per mile at a motorway service station. The evdb website gives the range of my AWD bZ4X as between 150 and 310 miles! The 150 miles figure is for motorway speeds in the winter. A realistic 'day trip' range should be around 200 - 220 miles over mostly normal A roads - I'll find out for sure over the next few months. And that's perfectly fine for me since that's way more than I'd do on a normal day. I don't yet have an EV tariff so it will cost be around 24p per kWh to charge and at around 3 miles per kWh that comes to 8p a mile (less once I get around to overnight, off peak, charging). So, that's a win for me and should work for most daily commutes. It all goes a bit 'pear shaped' when you switch to long range winter touring or 'road warrior' mode and you need to use DC rapid chargers! Most EVs will rapid charge from 10% to 80% in around 30 minutes. So you are restricted to using just 70% of the theoretical range and for the bZ4X that means around 100 miles between half hour recharge stops on a really cold day. I think / hope that I can cope with this since my 'range between breaks' isn't that much longer anyway! But your are then recharging at a motorway service station and paying around 90p per kWh or 30p per mile! For the occasional trip that shouldn't be too much of a problem but it wouldn't suit everyone. |
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Post by charliefarlie on Oct 29, 2024 20:30:56 GMT
In a game of top trumps, the ID.4 wins hands down ... but it's not a Toyota, and the bZ4X is. I haven't driven an ID.4 but I understand that they rather gone over the top with haptic buttons and touch controls; the bZ4X has proper buttons and knobs where it should and drives like a car. Anyhow, Charlie said the R word and that really determines whether or not we can each live with an EV. So ... My RAV 4.5 hybrid had a range of about 500 miles and the tank could be refilled pretty much anywhere in ten minutes so the effective limitation on how far you can go in a day is the driver (or drivers). And it would do around 10 miles to the litre, summer or winter so if you filled the tank at a local supermarket it costs around 13p per mile or around 16p per mile at a motorway service station. The evdb website gives the range of my AWD bZ4X as between 150 and 310 miles! The 150 miles figure is for motorway speeds in the winter. A realistic 'day trip' range should be around 200 - 220 miles over mostly normal A roads - I'll find out for sure over the next few months. And that's perfectly fine for me since that's way more than I'd do on a normal day. I don't yet have an EV tariff so it will cost be around 24p per kWh to charge and at around 3 miles per kWh that comes to 8p a mile (less once I get around to overnight, off peak, charging). So, that's a win for me and should work for most daily commutes. It all goes a bit 'pear shaped' when you switch to long range winter touring or 'road warrior' mode and you need to use DC rapid chargers! Most EVs will rapid charge from 10% to 80% in around 30 minutes. So you are restricted to using just 70% of the theoretical range and for the bZ4X that means around 100 miles between half hour recharge stops on a really cold day. I think / hope that I can cope with this since my 'range between breaks' isn't that much longer anyway! But your are then recharging at a motorway service station and paying around 90p per kWh or 30p per mile! For the occasional trip that shouldn't be too much of a problem but it wouldn't suit everyone. No criticism of your fine explanation but it may not surprise you to hear I may have to read it a few times to understand the numbers full. Now give me a tape measure and I can work out dimensions and set out a roof faster than most but I learnt that parrot fashion I say parrot fashion I say parrot fashion 🤪🤪 Everything else is not so easy…. Range anxiety for my daughter who travels an incredible amount of miles every week is the real downside of her car. The nits and bugs are one thing but attending important meetings with a car that says one thing one minute and another just a couple of miles later is a problem. Occasionally she rents a petrol or diesel car if she has a hectic few days. So the ID doesn't hold a great hand of cards in both her and my view… In essence it’s perhaps the wrong choice of car. She was …. Well not pushed into an electric car but steered by the tax benefits over and ICE car. Even so she now says it won’t be an electric car next time, That said electric cars are advancing at some pace so by the time the current one is due a change something better might be available 👍 |
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Post by philip42h on Oct 30, 2024 9:43:32 GMT
…. Range anxiety for my daughter who travels an incredible amount of miles every week is the real downside of her car. The nits and bugs are one thing but attending important meetings with a car that says one thing one minute and another just a couple of miles later is a problem. Occasionally she rents a petrol or diesel car if she has a hectic few days. So the ID doesn't hold a great hand of cards in both her and my view… In essence it’s perhaps the wrong choice of car. She was …. Well not pushed into an electric car but steered by the tax benefits over and ICE car. Even so she now says it won’t be an electric car next time, That said electric cars are advancing at some pace so by the time the current one is due a change something better might be available 👍 I suspect, as you say, that your daughter simply chose the wrong type of car for her current needs and a hybrid or plug-in hybrid would be better ... I'm not a fan of the way that company car schemes, tax and benefits distort the car market, but they do and there's nowt that I can do about it! And while the technology is advancing and the next generation of EVs will certainly be better, I can't see the range and refueling times matching those of current ICE powered cars. Our current 'requirements' for personal transport are derived from what ICE powered cars can deliver. Going forward we probably need a bit of "paradigm shift" to base our 'requirements' on what EVs can deliver. Doing that will be easier for some than it will for others ... I'm not troubled by 'range anxiety' as such - just as with an ICE car there's a 'range to empty' indicator so that I know that I will have to 'refuel' before I run out (and I don't have any excessive time pressures to worry about). But I do have a certain amount of 'recharge anxiety' to deal with - Will I be able to find an available and working charger and will I be able to make it work and pay for it when I get there? Putting petrol in a car is so much simpler ... |
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Post by Paulus17 on Oct 30, 2024 11:45:08 GMT
Lovely looking motor their Philip but having not seen one in the flesh/metal so to speak, i'm surprised at the size you are saying it is as our daughter seems to think it is more CHR size. She is taking her Yaris cross in for servicing on Friday to Toyota so she is hoping that they will have one in for her to look at so we will see. She got rid of her Rav as it was too big but liked the CHR size.
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Post by philip42h on Oct 30, 2024 13:10:27 GMT
Lovely looking motor their Philip but having not seen one in the flesh/metal so to speak, i'm surprised at the size you are saying it is as our daughter seems to think it is more CHR size. She is taking her Yaris cross in for servicing on Friday to Toyota so she is hoping that they will have one in for her to look at so we will see. She got rid of her Rav as it was too big but liked the CHR size. It's bigger than the RAV4 - honest! And way bigger than a C-HR - the wife has one of those. So, your daughter may be in for a shock / disappointment ... TBH I was looking to downsize too - I don't need anything as big as the RAV4 - but: - I didn't want to wait for Toyota to finally get around to launching the bZ3 - or whatever they will eventually call it
- I wasn't taken with any of the smaller offerings - but the Kia EV3 and Volvo EX30 are well worth a look ...
- And they are not that much smaller in any case - small EVs are quite BIG!
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Post by Paulus17 on Oct 30, 2024 16:12:16 GMT
Lovely looking motor their Philip but having not seen one in the flesh/metal so to speak, i'm surprised at the size you are saying it is as our daughter seems to think it is more CHR size. She is taking her Yaris cross in for servicing on Friday to Toyota so she is hoping that they will have one in for her to look at so we will see. She got rid of her Rav as it was too big but liked the CHR size. It's bigger than the RAV4 - honest! And way bigger than a C-HR - the wife has one of those. So, your daughter may be in for a shock / disappointment ... TBH I was looking to downsize too - I don't need anything as big as the RAV4 - but: - I didn't want to wait for Toyota to finally get around to launching the bZ3 - or whatever they will eventually call it
- I wasn't taken with any of the smaller offerings - but the Kia EV3 and Volvo EX30 are well worth a look ...
- And they are not that much smaller in any case - small EVs are quite BIG!
Time will tell Philip but i think she will be in for a shock if it is bigger. She'll probably end up keeping the Yaris. |
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Post by charliefarlie on Oct 30, 2024 17:44:10 GMT
Lovely looking motor their Philip but having not seen one in the flesh/metal so to speak, i'm surprised at the size you are saying it is as our daughter seems to think it is more CHR size. She is taking her Yaris cross in for servicing on Friday to Toyota so she is hoping that they will have one in for her to look at so we will see. She got rid of her Rav as it was too big but liked the CHR size. A much nicer classy car in the flesh Paul. It is at the risk of repeating myself a big car I was quite surprised. The black wing panels look indifferent in pictures but strangely not in the flesh. My eyes occasionally scan the classified ads for a Landcruiser but only because of towing our heavy caravan. I too like the CHR I’ve liked it a lot since it came out and there’s loads for sale but it’s actually quite a small car. Well in comparison to my old RAV 4 |
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Post by Paulus17 on Oct 31, 2024 11:16:49 GMT
Lovely looking motor their Philip but having not seen one in the flesh/metal so to speak, i'm surprised at the size you are saying it is as our daughter seems to think it is more CHR size. She is taking her Yaris cross in for servicing on Friday to Toyota so she is hoping that they will have one in for her to look at so we will see. She got rid of her Rav as it was too big but liked the CHR size. A much nicer classy car in the flesh Paul. It is at the risk of repeating myself a big car I was quite surprised. The black wing panels look indifferent in pictures but strangely not in the flesh. My eyes occasionally scan the classified ads for a Landcruiser but only because of towing our heavy caravan. I too like the CHR I’ve liked it a lot since it came out and there’s loads for sale but it’s actually quite a small car. Well in comparison to my old RAV 4 I will have to keep my eyes peeled more it  Daughter also likes the CHR but as you say Charlie it is, well feels compact/snug inside. She might change her mind and go for a CHR now as she was looking at cars to accommodate her big dog the Bernese mountain, but now she is letting him on the back seats, with a good cover on. |
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Post by philip42h on Nov 6, 2024 10:01:08 GMT
Efficiency: I was working on an assumption of between 3.0 and 3.5 miles per kWh ... but I may well have to rethink that! One of the challenges with a new car that comes from the same stable as one's old car is the way that you have rediscover that various settings and configurations that you set up four years ago (and forgot about completely since). Anyway, I had the RAV displaying fuel economy for each trip and I now have the bZ4X doing the same - instead of mile per gallon it shows miles per kWh. (Where the 'trip' starts when I switch the car on and ends when I switch it off.) It's amusing rather than truly useful! We know that fuel economy is better over a long, steady run and suffers with repeated short trips. With an ICE the engine needs to warm up to run efficiently but the heat provided to the car is 'free'; with an EV you are using power from the battery just to warm the car on a chilly day so overall economy suffers. Starting out it has shown up to 20 miles per kWh by the time I've got to the bottom of the lane (half a mile) - but it's downhill so I'm gaining power pretty much all the way. By the time I've got into town (<5 miles) it is likely to show around 3 miles / kWh. Unfortunately I also have to get home again and that trip is likely to show no better than 2 miles / kWh. Home is in Wales and, though the hills are not huge, the roads are nearly never level which doesn't do 'efficiency' any favours! All of which means that for local journeys on mild 'winter' days I'll need to be working on around 2.5 miles per kWh or around 10p per mile. Just as well that I didn't buy the car for economy specifically and certainly not for 'free' EV motoring ...  I need to plan some longer journeys - just for fun!  |
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Post by davrav on Nov 6, 2024 10:29:12 GMT
Can you not 'pre-heat' the interior with the car 'plugged in' Philip? I realise that still uses energy but, presumably more cost effectively.
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